FromSebastiánLelio, the director of the Academy Award-winningA Fantastic Woman,Disobediencefollows Ronit Krushka (Rachel Weisz), a woman who, upon the death of her estranged father, returns to the Orthodox community that shunned her years earlier for an attraction to a childhood friend. Once back, she is greeted with resentment and mistrust, and while that old passion is reignited, Ronit is also reminded of exactly why she left. The film also starsRachel McAdamsandAlessandroNivola.
At the film’s press day, Collider got the opportunity to sit down with actress Rachel Weisz, who also produced the film, for this 1-on-1 interview about why she wanted to develop this story into a feature film, her interest in exploring closed communities, what she learned about producing from being a part of this project, what made Sebastián Lelio the right director to handle this material, what makes this story relatable, and the story’s parallels toThe Shape of Water. She also talked about the type of characters she wants to play, developing a film about the fascinating life ofJames Miranda Berry, and reuniting with directorYorgosLanthimosforTheFavourite.
Collider: This is such a beautiful and tragic film.
RACHEL WEISZ: Thank you!
Everybody is just so tremendous in it. You became involved in this all the way back when it was in book form. From the beginning, were you looking at this as something you could both act in and produce?
WEISZ: That was the intention. Ten years ago, some producers said to me, “Do you want to start a production company and do all that stuff?” They said, “What sort of stories do you want to tell?” And I just really didn’t know. I knew scripts that I liked, if they came my way, but I didn’t know how to look for a story. But over the years, I’ve honed my personal taste. I know what my taste is, so I was looking for something that I wanted to play in, and I really wanted to find another good role for a woman. I thought it would be really interesting to have two female roles, and for them to be in relation to one another rather than in relation to a man, which is what I’ve done in probably every other film. So, I ended up reading a lot of lesbian novels and I thought this one was good because it’s contemporary. It’s not set in the ‘50s, when being gay was taboo. It’s set now, in a closed community, in North London. It’s three tube stops from where I grew up.
This is such an interesting story because it has those ‘50s ideals, even though it is contemporary.
WEISZ: Exactly. It’s a bit like that movieWitness, from the ‘80s, that’s set in the Amish communities, where some things are still taboo. I’m sure it’s the same thing with Muslim communities. I’m interested in closed communities.
Did you always know that it was this particular woman, of the two, that you wanted to play, or did you think about that?
WEISZ: I thought about playing Esti, and (writer/director) Sebastián [Lelio] was like, “No, you have to be Ronit!” They’re both wonderful parts. He said to me that, in a way, they’re like two halves of the same character. I’m the half that left, and she’s the half that stayed.
It shows what Ronit might have been if she had stayed.
WEISZ: Yeah, exactly!
How did you figure out who you wanted to playEsti?
WEISZ: Rachel [McAdams] is the first person that we went out to, and she just immediately responded with an enormous amount of passion. I spoke to her on the phone, and she really loved it. That’s what you want. She’s a brilliant, talented, incredible, luminous actress, but it was important that someone would really want to identify with Esti, and she completely identified with Esti.
What did doing a project like this teach you about producing? Do you feel like you know a little more about what that entails now?
WEISZ: Yeah, I think so. I was very involved in the novel to screenplay adaptation, and then casting, but once we started filming, I wasn’t involved in the production design, or cinematography, or anything visual. I just became an actress for hire. And then, when the filming ended, I got re-involved, in terms of the edit and the storytelling through editing, with the other producers. I definitely learned a lot. I learned that I can be somewhat objective, even though I’m watching myself in the film.
That seems like it would be one of the harder aspects of producing something you’re acting in.
WEISZ: It is and it isn’t. I actually didn’t find it that hard. I think Sebastián was quite surprised. When I first saw it, he said, “You know, actors normally freak out when they first see themselves,” but I didn’t, even though it was a rough cut and actors normally see things when they’re finished. I really like seeing it in its raw, unpolished state. I was pretty objective, up until a certain point, and then we just had to leave it to Sebastián because it’s his film and his vision.
What was it like having SebastiánLelioas that counterpart?
WEISZ: I completely trusted him. He’s got such empathy and sensitivity that made him a really good person to entrust the story to. You have to trust the director. They have to make the decisions on how the film is gonna look, which takes of your performance they’re gonna choose, how the movie is gonna end, and the tone of the film. It’s their medium. It’s not really an actor’s medium.
This is such a beautiful and tragic story about two women that I was surprised to learn the director was a man.
WEISZ: Listen, when I sawGloriaand I saw that Sebastián Lelio directed it, I would have bet my life that he was a gay man. I couldn’t believe that he’s not. He’s a straight man, but he breaks the mold.
Maybe it’s just about having an understanding and listening.
WEISZ: Yeah! He definitely, definitely, definitely listens. Everyone that’s worked with him would say the same. We all felt that we had his undivided attention, which of course, we didn’t really because he had a lot of people to pay attention to, but he makes you feel completely listened to. It’s a beautiful quality.
Because this is a closed community, how did you find ways to connect with this character?
WEISZ: Well, my character left like 15 or 20 years before, so I didn’t really have to connect with it. I have to feel uncomfortable returning to it, which was quite easy to do because it’s quite weird. It was more Alessandro [Nivola] and Rachel. They had to do a six-month immersion into becoming English, becoming Orthodox and becoming Jewish. They had to really live in that space, whereas I was playing a rebel who abandoned it. And my dad’s Jewish, so I know bits and bobs about it.
It’s very relatable and universal to see someone realize that you can leave a situation or a community, but you never really leave your past behind because it’s always a part of you.
WEISZ: you’re able to’t! You can’t run away. In the running, you lose something. That’s what happens with Ronit. She goes back and makes peace, and she can live her life without running anymore. She’s got the source of where she’s from in her, even though she’s not gonna stay there.
Do you think she wished that she would have had that moment with her father, before he was gone?
WEISZ: Oh, yeah, but who knows? Maybe it would have been awful. Maybe he would have just been really mean. In a way, maybe that was the best way to make peace with him, when he was in the ground. Poor Ronit. Poor all of them. They have a rough ride.
It seems like such a hard way to live, when you can’t actually voice how you’re feeling.
WEISZ: Yeah. For Esti, what a conundrum, to love God, love your community, love your job, love the girls that you’re teaching, and love your husband, but be gay. You have to give up all of that for your sexuality. It’s a really hard choice.
Especially when you’re made to feel like it’s wrong to be gay.
WEISZ: Yeah, poor Esti!
At this point in your career, what is it that you look for in roles and projects?
WEISZ: Male characters are allowed to be full of contradictions. They can be fathers, they can be transgressive, they can be needy, and they can be lustful. Women are often made spiritually anorexic, in a way. They lose their appetites and their passions, and it could be a passion for alcoholism, or a passion for teaching, or whatever it is. It’s not a moral spectrum, it’s contradictions that make characters believable. I want to play multi-layered characters and not a type, like “the girlfriend” or “the mother.” That’s just really boring, and not believable.
Yeah, because then it’s a character that’s in service of something or someone else.
WEISZ: Exactly! I’ve seen lots of great movies with men in the leads, and many of them are masterpieces, but I just feel like it’s time to address the balance a little bit.
Does it feel frustrating when those characters aren’t there, or do you feel like being more involved, as a producer, is helping you make them more there?
WEISZ: I’m definitely finding the roles that are more there. I’m not really complaining. I just feel like you’ve got to get on with it and make things happen.
You’re also working on a movie about James Miranda Berry, as a producer and actor, which sounds like an extremely fascinating story.
WEISZ: Yeah, really interesting.
How did you come across that story?
WEISZ: I can’t remember how I first found out about it. It’s not really a trans story because we don’t know if she was intersex. She wanted to be a doctor, and as a woman, you couldn’t go to university or become a doctor, so she became a man to follow her passion. She had an appetite for being a doctor. She was also quite unruly and difficult and a dandy, and she challenged people to fencing duels. She was a difficult personality. She wasn’t just this angelic Florence Nightingale type. Actually, I hear Florence Nightingale was a tough cookie. But she was difficult and she lost her temper with people. She had a big ego. She was a complex gal. They found out she was a woman. There were people who said that she had stretch marks on her belly when her body was buried, which looked like she’d had a child when she was younger. It’s a mystery.
When are you hoping to do that?
WEISZ: It’s being written. It’s going through the second draft of the screenplay. We have a writer, called Nick Yarborough, who lives here in L.A., and he’s writing it. He’s a very talented writer. He also wrote a script, calledA Letter from Rosemary Kennedy, which I think Elisabeth Moss is making right now. That was his first script, that he wrote about the Kennedy daughter who was lobotomized by her father. It’s a terrible story that was somewhat glossed over in the CNN documentary. That’s a tough story.
Do you know what you’re going to work on next?
WEISZ: I don’t know, no. I don’t know what I’m gonna do. I am shepherdingDisobedienceout into the world, this spring, and then in England in the fall. And then, I have a film coming out, calledTheFavourite, in the fall, which Yorgos Lanthimos directed. That has three female leads that are three very juicy roles.
What was it like reunite with him and work with him again, since doingThe Lobstertogether?
WEISZ: It was great! I just love working with him. There’s no one like him. He’s amazing! He’s one in a bajillion. I adore him.
Is he one of those directors that, whenever he calls, you’d say yes to working with him?
WEISZ: Whenever he calls, I’d say yes to anything.
What do you hope people take fromDisobedienceand the story of these women?
WEISZ: I think it’s a universal story. I think it’s as universal asThe Shape of Water. How can you be free to love who you want to love, in the place that you live or grew up, or wherever you are? In that case, it’s fantasy, it’s set in the ‘60s, and there’s a gay man, a black woman, a mute and a creature that people think is ugly, but is actually a beautiful god. This is present day, it’s naturalistic and it’s grounded, but I think they intersect. It’s about freedom to love who you want. It’s the same withA Fantastic Woman. It’s about the freedom. She wants to love and honor her dead boyfriend, but she can’t because society won’t let you love who you want to love, or be who you want to be. The films are really different genres, but I think they have the same heart.
