Back when Netflix’s adaptation ofShadow and Bonewas filming in Budapest last year, I was able to visit the set along with a few other reporters. Besides being able to observe a key scene from the finale and walk around some remarkable practical sets, we were able to speak with actorsJessie Mei Li(Alina Starkov) andSujaya Dasgupta(Zoya Nazyalensky) in a group setting. During the interview, they each talked about who they play, the way the series mixes together theSix of Crowscharacters with theShadow and Bonestory, why they made Alina half Shu Han and not just a Ravkan orphan, the diversity of the cast, how they each learned to choreograph their small science powers, why Mei Li andBen Barnes(who plays the Darkling) wanted to add consent to their relationship, what it was like imagining the Shadow Fold, and more.
If you’re not familiar withShadow and Bone, it’s based on the worldwide bestselling book series by authorLeigh Bardugoand theexecutive producer and showrunner isEric Heisserer, the writer of the sci-fi filmArrival. Unlike the book it is based on, the series actually combines two of Bardugo’s book series – the fantasy-adventure trilogyShadow and Boneand the duologySix of Crows, which chronologically takes place after the events ofShadow and Bonedespite being set in the same world. Heisserer said to make this work they essentially invented prequel stories for the key Six of Crows characters this season — Kaz, Inej, and Jesper — to fit alongside what is happening in theShadow and Bonestoryline.
The series takes place in a war-torn world where a lowly soldier and orphan named Alina Starkov (Mei Li) accidentally unleashes an extraordinary power that’s been residing in her that could help save her land and set her country free. What you also need to know aboutShadow and Boneis this world has magical soldiers known as Grisha that have different powers, and a massive black cloud (known as the Shadow Fold) that runs hundreds of miles north and south that is extremely dangerous to cross due to the creatures inside. While you can attempt to cross, it’s like playing roulette with your life.Shadow and Bonewas produced byShawn Levy’s 21 Laps Entertainment and also starsArchie Renaux(Malyen Oretsev),Freddy Carter(Kaz Brekker),Amita Suman(Inej Ghafa),Kit Young(Jesper Fahey),Julian Kostov(Fedyor Kaminsky) andDanielle Galligan(Nina Zenik).
Finally, before getting to the interview with Jessie Mei Li and Sujaya Dasgupta, if you haven’t seen theShadow and Bonetrailer, I’d watch that first. Will help you understand the world and what they’re talking about.
Shadow and Bonearrives on Netflix on April 23.
QUESTION: Zoya is very catty towards Alina in the first book. WithShadow and BoneandSix of Crowscombining, is that still her role?
SUJAYA DASGUPTA: Yeah it does come across as kind of almost like one side you only kind of see one side of Zoya in the first book. Because she is a mean girl, and she doesn’t really like Alina that much but I don’t think’s that apparent in the first book it kind of becomes a little bit more apparent. But I mean she goes on a real journey, and I think Leigh Bardugo said this as well as that Zoya was one of her favorite characters to write. Because she just kind of changes and she goes on a real journey and it’s just nice as an actor as well to kind of delve into it and just see where she starts and it’s just a richer arc for her.
And she does change. It’s a real lovely journey that she goes on and understanding her motivations and kind of like fleshing it out a lot more and adding a lot more depth to her. What makes her human and why she does these things, why doesn’t she like Lena, why she’s so mean in the first books, is really interesting to kind of delve into that and why she is how she is. So I think she’s a gorgeous character. But yeah very mean, very mean girl in the first one, which is always fun to play and so much fun for the two of us.
Can you just give like a general synopsis on the starting point of the journey and what each character is doing?
JESSIE MEI LI: At the start ofShadow and Bone, we find ourselves in Ravka which is a country that is torn in two by this expanse of darkness, that was created by the black heretic, who was a very powerful Grisha. And it’s populated with monsters. So where we find Alina is that she is a cartographer in the first army. So the first army is the army that have no powers, you know the just the general sort of foot soldiers of the king. And Zoya is in the Second Army, which is, the army that’s led by General Kirigan and they’re all the Grisha.
We find all the characters and they are going on a skiff, one of these wind powered boats that go through the Shadow Fold and Zoya is one of the drivers. And Alina just find herself through a series of unfortunate events, also being on the skiff. Yeah, so that’s where we start…where our love story begins [laugh].
RELATED:Here’s Why Netflix’s ‘Shadow and Bone’ Changed Alina’s Backstory to Make Her Half Shu
We’ve heard that most of the cast has read all the books. What was the most exciting part about getting to merge these two book series into sort of one story?
MEI LI: It’s really cool actually because the way they’ve done this show is they’ve made theSix of Crowscharacters to fit in with theShadow and Bonestory with their own kind of prequel. But it’s really clever how they’ve done it because you could almost readShadow and Boneagain and kind of nothing has changed, even with even the way that they’ve added in the characters. It’s almost like you could think, “oh, but they were there at that time, like maybe they were just behind that wall or whatever.” So it’s really interesting the way they’ve managed to sort of sneak them in. And just the crossover of getting everyone to meet at some point. Yeah. A hypothetical meeting [laughs]. Yeah. No, it’s really cool.
DASGUPTA: Yeah, cuz it doesn’t take away from any of the story of theShadow and Boneseries and things it just, adds to it.
MEI LI: I’m kind of intrigued because obviously as wellShadow and Bonebeing written in first person and you know you see everything from Alina’s perspective but having other characters from a different storyline having them, you know their perspective is really cool.
Jesse I know the character of Alina, they kind changed her a little bit to be half Shu. So let’s hear a little bit about that and how you ended up getting cast for the role?
MEI LI: Yeah, it was really interesting because obviously in the book she’s just, you know, a lonely Ravkan orphan. But they’ve really in this series they’ve kind of amped up the this is a war-torn country aspect of it. And obviously Ravka is at war with Shu Han. I think they wanted to add a little bit more adversity to Alina’s upbringing, you know her being not only an orphan but also an orphan that looks like the enemy, so you know she was really ostracized at the orphanage where she grew up and that’s why her and Mal brought together, obviously they also wanted Mal to be mixed race so they, you know, the two of them the two half breeds, as they say, sort of have more in common with each other.
It was good you know there are some scenes in, you know, the first few episodes where you know you sort of see Alina having people make like racist comments to her and stuff. It was really interesting they’ve added that and I think it adds a lot more to sort of understand who she is as a person and why she doesn’t feel worthy. Because her journey starts off as “I’m no one, you know I’m just an outsider” to suddenly being like “no, this is where I belong.”
But in the audition processes, I remember getting the audition through to my agent and looking at the breakdown I was like, “Oh, I never get mixed race roles, it’s always one or the other I never look enough of anything.” And you know I remember looking on looking at the books, I hadn’t read them, and I was like looking at the fanart, and I was like “that does not look like me.”
So that was really cool actually and you know they did a worldwide search. I think they got something like a thousand submissions. Hundreds of tapes and things like that so I thought I’m never going to get that. But it was really cool and it’s just, it’s really nice because I think about the young girls who are 13, like I was you know that impressionable age you don’t see people that represent you. I was talking to this woman I know and she’s got two Hapa nieces, and she was like, they loveShadow and Boneand they’re so excited that Alina’s gonna look like them. So yeah, it’s nice to be able to bring that and just. It’s a really diverse cast.
DASGUPTA: It’s such a diverse cast! Yeah, we always talk about kind of how progressive and just kind of what they’re saying with this show about diversity and the range of characters and looks and ethnicities that they’re putting into this world. Because it could be anywhere. And you know they’re adding a very rich texture having people from various different backgrounds and all over the world really, in the show as an actor.
MEI LI: So, because it’s both like that, some of it, people’s ethnicity is talked about at some points, like, obviously with Alina and I think in a certain way, with Inej as well. But then also there’s the side of it’s not a big deal. You know these are all just different people from all around the world, which is really cool.
One of the things that I was surprised to learn that Eric said was that all eight of the scripts have been written prior to the film, which is highly unusual. So talk a little bit about having all eight scripts, I’m assuming you’ve got them before filming?
MEI LI: Well no, we got them. So I think I, myself and Archie we know we came out first and I think we had the first two when we got here and then for pretty much the whole of the first block we didn’t have the next block. So it’s really you know every time that we finally got sent them we got one and two, three and four and five and six and seven and eight. So I don’t think we read eight until maybe November.
DASGUPTA: We were kind of drip fed kind of the scripts so we didn’t have like a “Oh my god Eric,”
MEI LI: And we’re all there just like on the group chat like, “Omg did you read that.” It was probably, you know, we got them in advance, but like, kind of, we were still finding things out as we went along. But then every now and then, one of the departments might drop a little hint here and yeah. “This costumes for that thing” and you’re like, “What thing? Sorry?” But you can really tell having you know now read all of them and pretty much finished all of them, it all comes together so well. Things that are referenced at the beginning are brought back and it’s not just a sort of episodic and very isolated thing. It’s a full story, and you know there are motifs and things that keep coming back and it’s just it’s really well put together.
Are there characters from the books fans would be surprised to see Alina meet and interact with?
MEI LI: Well I mean most of the characters fromSix of Crowsthat would be quite exciting for fans I think. You know, some of the characters from the books have been given different roles almost in sort of the part of Alina’s story. And so I think there are some characters who go like “hey, but she didn’t do that” or “he didn’t He wasn’t there” or whatever but they’ve managed to change that so I think that the readers of the book they’ll be like, maybe a bit “oh my gosh, I wasn’t expecting that.” But it’s done really well.
You guys are both Grishas, did you learn the choreography to show your small science, what was it like feeling like being directed when you were controlling the wind?
DASGUPTA: So cool. We get kind of choreography from the stunt team and things and it’s just like, you know, different activations for different whatever you’re doing, like if Zoya’s kind of blowing winds at the sails or, you know, blasting Alina off or whatever. It’s all different kind of stuff and you know the special effects team and everything like that they just add so much to it’s that you feel very much like it’s happening in front of your eyes. which is so cool.
MEI LI: Yeah, knowing that you just did that.
DASGUPTA: And you fully feel so empowered like you literally did that. And it was like “Omg I just did that” and yes it’s just yeah it’s amazing. Did you learn different ones?
MEI LI: So it’s slightly different with me because at the start, Alina’s powers come out when she’s feeling. It’s not on purpose so it’s like an emotional response. And there was very much because you know they had all these…our stunt team were amazing, a lot of them worked onDoctor Strangeand things like that so obviously you’ve got almost like tutting kind of hand movements. And so they’d come up with all these different activations for different Grisha. You know Squalors have a certain hand movement and then Heartrenders have a different one.
But we kind of muddled through Alina almost in a sense that like, it was kind…the stunt team said to me, just go with what feels natural to you in that moment you know you’re angry. So, do what feels right. So quite often most of the things that I do in the show is just what I’ve made up on the spot. Yeah, so it’s going to be interesting because I mean there’s been times when we’ve done something in a wide, and I’m like “well I’m married to that now, gotta keep doing that” but it’s been really good because it means that you know, especially the audience will see Alina’s journey. And I think when she sort of starts to use her powers midway through and she’s learning to be a bit more competent with it. It’s not quite perfect, which was a conscious choice whereas towards the end, you know the movements are more solid.
DASGUPTA: They’re not there yet, they’re kind of rough and ready rather than the other Grisha. We’ve learned it, we’ve spent the years using these activations. Yeah, we know what we’re doing and it’s a very specialized move.
MEI LI: It’s almost like this is uncharted territory really because no one’s been a Sun Summoner before so it’s almost like well, just, I like that it was organic, and I could just make it up. Obviously the stunt team was always there, if I was like, “Hey does this look good?” Yeah, that’s pretty cool. Some of the Grisha parts just look so cool.
Can you talk a little bit about the relationship between Alina and the Darkling, which is a huge cornerstone of the series in general, and also sort of finding that dynamic with Ben Barnes.
MEI LI: Yeah, I mean I think the way they’ve done it. And I don’t know if it’s a spoiler probably not, but obviously they have a relationship of sorts. And I think they’ve managed to make it sort of… There was a big little big conversation about for me and for Ben we’ve talked a lot about consent. Because obviously the book says it’s kind of like villain like “Oh, I’m gonna get you” kind of thing. But we had lots of conversations with the producers and our showrunner Eric about kind of making it Alina’s choice. That “I want this” and it’s not being forced upon her. I think that was really interesting to come up with together and then putting it into practice has made the scenes more interesting as well rather than just being like “it’s a dark room and I’m going to grab you now.”
Ben and I got on so well so it was just a lot of fun and when you’re having to be like intimate and stuff it can be a bit awkward but it just totally wasn’t. It was really like lots of fun. It’s funny as well having the difference between the Alina and Kirigan relationship and the Alina and Mal relationship and having to play those two different sort of roles almost. So that’s been really fun to do that kind of like sweet pure love kind of thing. And then the more like should I shouldn’t I” sort of things.
What’s like a day or two that you’ll remember from filming. Is there like something that really stood out.
DASGUPTA: It’s all been so much fun, so much.
MEI LI: It was so much fun. I think a day that stood out for me would probably be a scene that we had together. We and Sujaya have a scene together that was a lot of fun to film because, as you stated before, our characters don’t like each other and obviously I just remember finding it all very hysterical. Like looking at you like I hated you which was really hard.
DASGUPTA: Because Jessie is just looking at me trying to make me laugh, you know, trying to kiss me or whatever. Yeah, that was fun.
MEI LI: Yeah, those are fun days and it’s just been so many just amazing sets and things to a point where, you know, certainly in the first two episodes you know we have this entire army encampment, and it’s just seeing the scale of everything. You don’t even need to act because you’re just like, oh look there’s a goat. Those are the 300 people over there.
DASGUPTA: It was an actor’s paradise isn’t it. It was just like, everything was given to you. There’s not a lot left to the imagination, it was just to the last detail as well it was, it was beautiful. And just working with everyone, particularly as a group as well those group days, when we were out and the amazing locations and you kind of don’t know where you are sometimes and things and you’re just fully in this world. You’re just all together.
MEI LI: And there’s always that magic moment it’s normally around sort of 4pm when everyone’s losing their minds when you have been working for 13 hours. That’s always this the golden hour.
On the flip side of being an actor’s paradise, the Shadow Fold was all green screen. So what was it like kind of finding motivation, without knowing what it looks like?
DASGUPTA: I mean the books kind of give you a massive description of like you know, it’s already kind of filled your imagination of the world you’re inhabiting. So you have that you have that kind of going into stuff. But stuff like green screen, I haven’t really worked with green screen before, but in drama school you have to play with your imagination and practice it. The director is heavily involved in giving you like simulism, calling out like this “now this is happening, imagine this and that” and then you’ve got you know the wind machines and everything going on sound, light, and everything like that so you still feel kind of fully immersed. But your imagination goes crazy. But then the Fold and everything like that, you can imagine from the books like the worst scariest place imaginable. Like, scary ass monsters and things like that.
MEI LI: It has been really strange because like you I’ve never done green screen or anything like that and interacting with things that aren’t there. It’s always just about getting of like, “what am I looking at, where is it?” But you know you learn and the crew are just amazing. Everyone’s always on hand to say like “actually change your eyeline to here and that will read a bit better” and things like that. So, it’s been yeah lots of fun. It’d be really interesting to see if it looks anything like we were all imagining. I think it will.
Have you seen any previz?
MEI LI: We’ve seen lots of the concept art and previews and stuff and it’s just amazing.
A bit of a language question. There are obviously a lot of Brits in this cast. Is that sort of the natural accent that everybody is using in this Ravka and also like how does that play with the Russian terminology, but it seems to be very prevalence.
MEI LI: I think it was, it’s interesting they went with the British accent just because I think it just sort of happened due to who was being cast. And I think the way it works with Ravkan certainly is, if you were sort of from a certain area you have a pretty British accent. So we’re mainly using our natural accents and then there are various other characters who are also Ravkan but they have slightly different. Also because in this world it’s not a real place so you can just make up whatever accent you want. So you’ve got some that maybe sound a bit Scandinavian or Russian or…The idea of that is they’re just from slightly different parts of the country and parts of the countryside and things.
DASGUPTA: It’s interesting is interesting isn’t it. Because there were some people from Europe like Denmark and Czech Republic and things like that and they kept their natural accents. It’s really beautiful to hear against kind of majority of British accents. But you buy into it, and it doesn’t sound kind of obtuse or it doesn’t stick out or anything like that. And in terms of the Russian and the terminology like Leigh based it a little bit like on Russian language right, but some are kind of Ravkan names for this, for the Grisha verse. But when we say it doesn’t sound weird or anything.
MEI LI: It was funny that we had a…we had a phonetical breakdown of all the sort of names and words. But the funny thing was I remember it was quite early on in filming and I had to say Ketterdam. And, you know, especially in the scene saying it fast I’m saying Ketterdam and our script supervisor who is Hungarian she’s like, “you’re not saying it right” and I was like, “what do you mean?” Because she’s got the guide in front of her and she’s like “Ked der dam,” and I was like, “it is Ked der dam if you’re American it is not in my accent. She was like “can you just do it for me I just need to verify everyone is saying it consistently” and I said “I will say it but it will sound weird as hell.” I was like “blah blah Ked der dam” and she was like “Oh no, that was really weird.” We had this entire sort of, you know, phonetic names and they were all in an American accent, so then that had to be changed.
Did you have a word that was pretty really difficult for you?
DASGUPTA: I did, I really did. It was Otkazat’sya.
MEI LI: Eventually you got it, but yeah there’s some discrepancies during table reads there will be times like we’re all saying the same place in a completely different way. It was great but they got it right.
DASGUPTA: Yeah, in the end.
Since both your characters go on to grow in subsequent books, did that affect kind of how you played your current character knowing what their legacy and who they’ll be as a grown up.
DASGUPTA: That’s a good one, because I always think of this is like, if you’re doing a film or a theater show and things like that you have your through line so you know where your character ends up and it’s about kind of forgetting that but having that and then working and building like an arc and stuff. For this, because there’s such a range of books and you know where this character goes, you kind of have to put that aside almost but use it as a kind of building up an idea of the character working on fleshing her out and things like that. So that’s when it helped and that’s when it kind of, but you always have to forget where she ends up or what happens to her down the line otherwise you’re just kind of playing the ending almost when you come to the beginning of the show, and, you know, it’s always constantly reminding us of none of that happened [yet]. She doesn’t know anything that’s about to happen. Bringing the audience on that journey with her because it has to be new to them and new to her. So, yes, it’s wonderful to have that wealth of information and things and you always have to kind of let it drop in but then let it go as well.
MEI LI: It’s the same thing for Alina because you know, over the trilogy, she has such an arc. And it’s you know if I’d never read the books I would almost maybe think, you know, by the end of the series she’s got to this point, when actually, she probably just got here, in terms of like how powerful and how confident. So it almost gave me like a ceiling of that’s how we’re going to get to in this series, and there’s more growth there. Because you don’t have to go heavy, don’t give it all [at first]. Yeah, no, it’s cool sort of knowing where things might end up. It’s always exciting because you know what could happen. Where they could end up.
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